Can't say whether this was discussed before, but still hope for this idea to get some traction here...
Slovenia today is an "independent" country. It used to be part of Yugoslavia (which was federation of republics), before that a part of Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes. Now the Tokens issued in former Yugoslav federal republic of Slovenia are only displayed under Yugoslavia, but not also under nowadays Slovenia. I know this is how it works here now, but this is not correct, there is a longer history and its not displayed properly.
Hence Yugoslavia should from Tokens point of view be separated on lower level to six federal republics and tokens should be set up accordingly. Now if user would be searching tokens in Slovenia with this upgrade (or Croatia, Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Macedonia and Montenegro, lets leave out of this Vojvodina and Kosovo), he/she would/should get hits also from Yugoslavia, but displayed separately in different Currency section of this search like "Slovenia under Yugoslavia" (or maybe Former Yugoslav republic of Slovenia) and current "Slovenia to-date".
I hope a country being an ex-federal entity would be enough to make this proposal be accepted.
I can imagine this opens up the similar Pandoras box for other far bigger existing (US) and dissolved countries (like USSR), but I guess it is all about having good data, to be percieved as a good source. Similar solution is already applied for German Notgeld, so I cannot see any reason why it would not be implemented also for tokens from Yugoslavia and other federal states.
If more data is needed, feel free to contact me privately.
To me, it's quite simple - was the token issued in Yugoslavia or Slovenia? That's your answer.
To apply what you're suggesting is not straightforward, i.e. what are you going to with countries/regions that were under USSR and Germany in the early XXth century? And that's just one of many examples. Having a section for the same country under multiple issuing authorities isn't correct and would make finding a specific token harder than it is now, which is what you're essentially trying to solve.
Quote: "lebryant"To me, it's quite simple - was the token issued in Yugoslavia or Slovenia? That's your answer.
It all depends from the your narrow point of view.
Well, if your search parameter is "hungary" you get the coins from middle ages on, including AustroHungarian empire. So if Hungary was part of bigger empire (lets say empire ranks the same as federation), then I do not see any reason why Tokens issued in Socialistic Republic of Slovenia would not be shown also when search parameter is "token slovenia" (beside those coins, that have the string "slovenia" included on the page).
So I don't know why would someone get hits for some other country dating thousand years back, but for Slovenia, lets be selective and do not show it.
I think a problem that arises with tokens specifically is that because they can be issued by so many different entities for so many different reasons, trying to work towards absolute accuracy would fragment that catalog even more than it already is. With coins the categorization is usually (but not always) much simpler since we're dealing with governments. But tokens are not coins. Anybody can theoretically make and distribute tokens. If I issue my own tokens that can only be used in my apartment, do we consider those USA tokens or tokens from my specific state or from my specific city or from my neighborhood or specific to my name?
I think it's correct to say that the current system isn't 100% accurate and the former Yugoslav republics are a good example of this. However, any categorization is going to introduce some sort of artificial distinction. The challenge is balancing strict accuracy against usability. Tokens are already a huge unwieldy beast. I don't think it necessarily makes sense to add even more complexity. Then again, I don't have very many tokens so mine might be a minority opinion here.
Hello.
For Soviet tokens made in some republic, there is a solution (perhaps not ideal): the republic is indicated in brackets in the title (as the state is now indicated for US tokens).
Quote: "seltsamesammler"I think a problem that arises with tokens specifically is that because they can be issued by so many different entities for so many different reasons, trying to work towards absolute accuracy would fragment that catalog even more than it already is. With coins the categorization is usually (but not always) much simpler since we're dealing with governments. But tokens are not coins. Anybody can theoretically make and distribute tokens. If I issue my own tokens that can only be used in my apartment, do we consider those USA tokens or tokens from my specific state or from my specific city or from my neighborhood or specific to my name?
I think it's correct to say that the current system isn't 100% accurate and the former Yugoslav republics are a good example of this. However, any categorization is going to introduce some sort of artificial distinction. The challenge is balancing strict accuracy against usability. Tokens are already a huge unwieldy beast. I don't think it necessarily makes sense to add even more complexity. Then again, I don't have very many tokens so mine might be a minority opinion here.
Hi
My point of view is adding as much credible and correct data as possible on origin, issuer, everything directly connected. Issuer should be added to the name of the token, city where the token was issued added in round brackets (these two have solution, no need to go deeper here). In case you don't know from which federal state token comes, then you leave just "US". I am sure there are also collectors, that collect tokens only from the state they live in and there for differentiating tokens on federal level gives a bigger value to the data and the site itself.
I look upon Numista as cultural heritage site... constantly updated by "plebs".
It seems that Xavier already has the token section in mind for an overhaul. It sounds like his approach would resolve this issue by just making tokens/exonumia into full sections rather than just being tacked on as a coin category.
