identification

7 posts • viewed 171 times

Good afternoon,

 

I have a copper coin 27 mm diameter, thickness 1 mm

 

Head side:   text  (?)ORGIVS  LLVDOVICVS XVI

 

Tail side: completely worn

 

I tried Louis XVI of France, but they all do not have (G)ORGIVS

 

There is a George Louis of Bergen, but I could not find coins of this duke and moreover he was not the 16th.

Thanks in advance for your help,

 

Cor den Boer

Hi, 

I could find this coin in this catalogue of copper coinage in a list containing Halfpenny's tokens. 

 

<  O. — Laureate Bust to left, "Georgivs Lludovicus XVI." R. — Blank.>

 

 

N 4405 page 453 (of the book) 

Batty's catalogue of the copper coinage of Great Britain, Ireland, British isles, and colonies, local &amp; private tokens, jettons, &amp;c., compiled from various authors

 

I hope it helps.

 

 

https://archive.org/details/battyscatalogue01battgoog/page/n127/mode/1up

Hamza

United Kingdom, British Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies › 

United Kingdom • Evasion tokens (1751-1797) 

 That is the Section heading on here. 

----------------------

Interesting quote from somewhere: 

The British anti-counterfeiting laws. From 1760-1816, the mint was absolutely terrible about issuing coins that could be used by the average citizen for normal transactions. Copper and silver coins essentially didn't exist for many years, with a few exceptions -- a large issue of 6d and shillings in 1787, and farthings/halfpence from 1770-1775. After that, there were no pennies issued until 1797, nor halfpence or farthings until 1799. After 1787, regular silver issues didn't exist until 1816 (with the exception of semi-official Bank of England tokens from 1811-1816). Strangely, gold coins were minted almost every year during this period.


This raises two questions: Why were there so few minor coins, and what did the average person use for small transactions? The lack of coins was largely because the mint discovered that rather than circulating, the coins were being melted and made into lightweight counterfeits. Some were quite believable-looking, and were often made to appear worn even when actually new. Making the anti-counterfeiting laws more severe didn't stop this practice, and the mint finally stopped making copper coins in 1775. Counterfeiting was still illegal, but someone figured out a clever way around the letter of the law -- it only applied to exact copies of the official coins. Hence, the "evasion tokens" -- privately made "coins" designed to look somewhat like the real issues, but not close enough to be considered counterfeits. Generally, this meant the head of someone resembling George III (or George II) and a legend that ranged from a variation on the real one to complete nonsense. Same for the reverse -- some central design in place of the Britannia found on the real coins, and a made-up legend. Since many people using these tokens were illiterate, "somewhat resembling the real thing" was usually good enough. Of course, the tokens were lighter than the real coins. There are hundreds of different types.


In 1787, a clever merchant decided to make tokens that promoted his business. They were not considered counterfeits since they were not designed to resemble the former issues of official coins. These were popular for another 30 years, and there are over a thousand different types. They are known as "Conder Tokens" because James Conder wrote the first book attempting to catalogue them. 

Token collector [1600-1899] with some coins

Thank you both very much for your help.

 

Kind regards,

 

 

 

Cor den Boer

Evasion tokens cost me my night rest, fascinating subject!

 

Thank you again.

 

Cor den Boer

 Thanks. It was similar for me - I used to collect coins, 

then found out about Conder Tokens, and now have 158 of them - so far … 

 

Token collector [1600-1899] with some coins

 Lastly, that made me wonder what my first Conder Token was, 

and I think it was this, from 2014 > 

https://en.numista.com/forum/topic26900-3.html#p262270 

https://en.numista.com/forum/topic31194.html#p263450  

 with the elephant on one side and Lady Godiva on the other. 

N#20899 

So this year is the tenth anniversary of my first one. 

Have not got any for quite a while as I seem to have most of them, within my price range. 

Token collector [1600-1899] with some coins

» Forum policy

Used time zone is UTC+2:00.
Current time is 19:03.