The coin is in perfect condition, both sides of the coin, except that there is a hole at the bottom of the coin. On the side with the two eagles the hole is located at the feet area. Why would someone place a hole and what is the coin worth with this hole?
I would like to thank the forum in advance for responding to my question.
My questions are, why the hole? What is, plus or minus, the value of the coin? Is the coin according to the expertize here, in good shape, medium, horrible?
If you have any other information that you think it would be of value I would love to hear more about this coin.
Hello Florie and welcome to the world of Numista. Thanks for uploading your pictures - they are very helpful and it's a beautiful coin. Before we can start putting a value to it, we need to determine exactly what it is. Firstly, from what I can read the obverse says "FRANCISCVS I.D.G.AUSTRIAE.IMPERATOR" which tells us it is Franz I, Austrian Emperor (1806-1835). As far as I can make out on the reverse, we have "D.LO.SAL.WIRC.1809.HVN.BOH.GAL.REX.A.A" (I'm really not sure about some of that). I don't think your coin is on the Numista catalog at the moment but once we have found out what it is we can help you add it. We are going to need some more data from you, such as the weight and diameter, as accurately as you can manage. Until we have that information, I don't really want to go guessing what it might be.
(Edit: Just noticed what looks like it might be a "C" mintmark on the obverse under the hole).
Just because you can't see it ... doesn't mean it isn't there - Anon.
I saw a similar 1825 coin with slightly different lettering, and it was called a France Thaler.
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P.S. I have since seen a gold version of this coin, and has exact same lettering as yours, and 1809 date. So yes the one above is silver; and the gold one is called a Dukat. It is on the link below (item 989) ...
It is a long way (about 80%) down the page, and is in German, from an auction. There are pictures of it. The section it is in is headed 'KAISERREICH ÖSTERREICH' and the wording is as follows ...
Franz I., 1804-1835. Dukat 1809, Salzburg, für das Herzogtum Salzburg.
FRANCISCVS I D G AVSTRIAE IMPERATOR. Kopf mit Lorbeerkranz rechts, darunter Mzstz. D //
HVN BOH GAL REX A A - D LO SAL WIRC 1809. Gekrönter Doppeladler mit Insignien und mit Ordensketten behängtem Brustschild.
Probzst 2630; J. 164; Fr. 890. Gold. Vorzüglich CHF 1.000,-
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Finally, I just found a really good site that gives full Latin words for abbreviations. So,
D G AVSTRIAE IMPERATOR
HVN BOH GAL REX A A D LO SAL WIRC is translated as
Dei Gratia Austriae Imperator
Hungariae Bohemiae Galiciae Rex Archidux Austriae Dux Lotharingiae Salisburgi Wirceburgi
It is number 325 on the page below, or a search can be made on there. It is an Italian site ...
It is not French after all, and is Austrian. But it is a Thaler. Diameter 40mm. Reference KM# 2160.
Austria Thaler 1809C is valued (without damage) on this ...
Thank you to both of you for the responses. A magnifying glass reveals the wording on the coin is as follows, the front of the coin reads: Franciscus I* D*G* AVSTRI(reverse V)E IMPERATOR There is a "C" at the bottom of the coin. The back of the coin reads: D*LO*SAL*WTRC*1809 HVN* BOH* GAL* REX*A*A - This is very clear -
I hope this helps in identifying the coin. At the widest area the coin is 1.25." I will add the weight tomorrow.
What was the purpose of the hole on the coin?
Thank you again.
With a diameter of 1.25" or roughly 32mm, even taking into account circulation wear, it is too small to be a Thaler. Consequently, my guess is that it is an Austria KM#2151 ½ Thaler 1809C and the original diameter would have been in the region of 35mm. When you measure the weight you should be looking for something like 14g, again possibly slightly less due to wear. With regard to the hole, there has been some mention on other posts on this forum that these holes were sometimes made to confirm that the coin was genuine.
Just because you can't see it ... doesn't mean it isn't there - Anon.
Don't know where on the coin the face value is stamped, though I know for UK coins there were most if not all, up to and including Queen Victoria, that had no value on either; so guess the population were just supposed to know what they were. Later Victorian coins started to have values on, such as pennies and so on.
Those are the same values as shown in my 5th Edition 1801-1900 Krause, but they also give a value for Fine as being $150. Now I'm no professional but IMHO, if we forget about the hole, then I would grade this coin as F. How the presence of the hole would affect the grade or value I have no idea but, in the words of one a lot wiser than myself, "The value of any given coin is only as much as someone is prepared to pay for it".
florie to numista an
